Author Topic: Catholic Leaders Declare War On Obama (Read 2693 times)

silverbear · « **Reply #30 on:** February 08, 2012, 07:19:00 PM »

I'm so confused. Will all Catholics now be forced to use birth control? Is that why my way-past-menopausal, cafeteria Catholic mother-in-law is screeching about her loss of religious freedom?

gunslinger · « **Reply #31 on:** February 08, 2012, 07:37:00 PM »

Quote from: johnqpublic on February 08, 2012, 12:58:37 AM

To borrow a phrase here, First they came for the Catholics....

I wonder what the Amish will think when they come after their belief system? Who's going to warn them, if not the Internet?

Quote from: EvilJam on February 08, 2012, 05:46:48 PM

Back in Jesus' day 15 year olds were already
married. Unable to keep it in their pants,
their parents opted to get the kiddies married
off so that little Suzy remained an "honest
woman."
That's not feasible these days. Fifteen year
olds today can barely tie their shoes.

... evil

15 was middle aged in Jesus' day. 15 year olds had parents with one foot in the grave back then.
FTR, my children could all survive on their own by the time they were 15 - it comes with being raised properly.

LarryTheCableGuy · « **Reply #32 on:** February 08, 2012, 07:37:30 PM »

Here's a perfect example of what happens when the state starts bullying churches:

http://www.theblaze.com/stories/author-eric-metaxas-compares-govt-contraceptive-mandate-to-pre-holocaust-policies-in-germany/

EvilJam · « **Reply #33 on:** February 08, 2012, 07:58:08 PM »

Quote from: LarryTheCableGuy on February 08, 2012, 06:35:08 PM

And the other point is, why did Obama pick this particular time to goad the catholic ox?
In his arrogance, he probably figures he can get away with it.

Exactly. And why not?? He looked at these...

... and flipped off The Church with an "eat your peas!"

Story: WYFP??, DemFromCT, dKos

- end quote - - end quote - - end quote -

yep. These whiners ain't voting for the O-Man anyway.
Bam Bam looked at the numbers and rolled the dice.

The bottom line, I suspect (and I could be totally
wrong, off base), is that Bam Bam figures that if
he's gonna lose in 2012 he's going to do it on his
terms, F* everybody else.
Including The Church. Hell, especially The Church.

But, as the numbers suggest, he don't lose on this
non-issue.

... evil

dummer51 · « **Reply #34 on:** February 08, 2012, 08:02:26 PM »

Quote from: silverbear on February 08, 2012, 07:19:00 PM

I'm so confused. Will all Catholics now be forced to use birth control? Is that why my way-past-menopausal, cafeteria Catholic mother-in-law is screeching about her loss of religious freedom?

No. The usurping of the constitution is the issue.

EvilJam · « **Reply #35 on:** February 08, 2012, 08:57:36 PM »

Constitution??

See you in court.

... evil

MAMAD · « **Reply #36 on:** February 09, 2012, 12:10:45 AM »

Gee, Dummer, Isn't playing with those "toys" a sin?

johnqpublic · « **Reply #37 on:** February 09, 2012, 12:59:43 AM »

Ummm, no. Those other groups have nothing to do with the establishment clause of the First Amendment, which is what we're talking about here.

Ummm, but the First Amendment is not the only amendment. There's the equal protection clause of the Fourteenth, and several others likely apply to the unfair, unequal and arbitrary enforcement of the bullshit law I alluded to here. The Tenth comes to mind since the government was not granted the power to force someone to buy something; the Eighth might apply too since it's unsual to say the least for the government to impose a fine on someone for refusing or neglecting to buy something; the Fourth might kick in too since a person might reasonably be perceived to not be secure in their persons or effects if the government can snoop to ensurfe they're in compliance -- though I grant that one might be a lost cause already since the courts have already allowed the egregious DWI and seatbelt compliance checkpoints.

...Will all Catholics now be forced to use birth control?....

No. But they will be forced to pay for it whether they choose to use it or not.

silverbear · « **Reply #38 on:** February 09, 2012, 09:50:17 AM »

Quote from: johnqpublic on February 09, 2012, 12:59:43 AM

...Will all Catholics now be forced to use birth control?....

No. But they will be forced to pay for it whether they choose to use it or not.

I should have used a tongue-in-cheek emoticon.

Catholics who purchase their health insurance through a secular employer pay for the birth control used by other sinners.

Catholics also pay taxes, which get used to implement the death penalty, which the church also strictly opposes.

I'm just sayin'

johnqpublic · « **Reply #39 on:** February 09, 2012, 11:27:36 AM »

Catholics who purchase their own pay for their own. Whether birth control is included is sort of a forced issue and one that adds to the princely price of premiums. More government intrusion where it don't belong. My policy, for example, likely includes a host of gynecological procedures and yours likely allows for, say, prostate exams. Neither one of us will ever use it, but it's there and we're paying for it by government fiat. So far as I know, though, none of those is contrary to the tenets of either of our respective religions. As for the taxes/death penalty nexus? Well, that's the price one pays to assimilate into a given society. Some religions OK killing one's spouse or progeny when they are deemed to have "disgraced" the family name. The government rightly frowns on that and makes laws to proscribe the practice. That would be a necessary evil of government, an intrusion for the sake of civility and humanity. Some might object to their taxes paying to support the military too, but, well.... Just sayin'.

dummer51 · « **Reply #40 on:** February 09, 2012, 02:32:49 PM »

Quote from: EvilJam on February 08, 2012, 08:57:36 PM

Constitution??

See you in court.

... evil

haha...howdy howdy!

Quote

Mamad
Gee, Dummer, Isn't playing with those "toys" a sin? Huh Grin

Life has made you very bitter. My sympathies. You just don't get it.

MAMAD · « **Reply #41 on:** February 09, 2012, 07:47:29 PM »

Dummer, why do you believe I am bitter? Because I don't believe that religion has any place in government or outside your home and place of worship? I believe people should follow the rules, which includes all people and religion should not be a way around the rules. Sooo sorry if you disagree. That is your right.

I am sick of illegal breeders and welfare whores living off my tax dollars. When going on welfare ,I would endorce mandatory birth control. I don't give a sh!t what the church says about it. It is the only way they will get any new members. Why should we pay for these people to have children they can't afford. We all suffer, especially the children. They don't have a chance. You sure don't see the catholic church supporting these children. Birth control and mandatory job training and a job. I don't mind helping people, I just don't want to support them. I believe in making people take responsability for their life and their family. If they won't, no help available.

Eric · « **Reply #42 on:** February 09, 2012, 09:53:55 PM »

Non-issue gonna occupy a few hours of prime time in an election year.

http://motherjones.com/politics/2012/02/controversial-obama-birth-control-rule-already-law

I know, it's Mother Jones, so 9 out of 10 of you are gonna be *ACK, LIBERAL!!!1!!!* - but there's facts in there. They've been facts for years.

EvilJam · « **Reply #43 on:** February 10, 2012, 12:13:19 AM »

"Ninety-eight, ninety-nine percent of women have taken contraception in their lifetime.
This is common health care for women, and they should not be told by their bosses what
medicines they are allowed to take."

Indeed.

Saying she spoke with the president yesterday,

"He shares our values, he shares our goals, he's committed to making sure that all women
in America have access to affordable birth control."

Earlier the senator's office released this press release, saying:
“We Will Not Stand for This Massive Overreach To Undermine The Ability of Women to Make
Their Own Decisions”

Washington D.C. – U.S. Senator Kirsten Gillibrand (D-NY) released the following statement
today after a USA Today story today revealed the extent to which opponents of women’s
access to the full range of preventive health services, including contraception, want a “religious
exemption” to go. Anthony Picarello, general counsel for the U.S. Conference of Catholic
Bishops argued any business or corporation owned by Catholics should be excluded when he
cited the problem that would be created for, "good Catholic business people who can't in good
conscience cooperate with this." He went as far to say, "If I quit this job and opened a Taco
Bell, I'd be covered by the mandate.”

“I am dumbfounded that in the year 2012 we still have to fight over birth control.
It is sad that we have to stand here yet again to fight back against another overreach
and intrusion into women’s lives.

“This is what it is – a political overreach to roll back access to birth control –
not a religious issue. The fact they want to exempt all businesses from providing
contraceptive care is just outrageous.

“The power to decide whether or not each individual woman uses contraception should
be with that woman – not her boss. We will not stand for these attempts to undermine the
ability of women to make their own decisions.

“If my Republican colleagues want to continue to take this issue head on, we stand ready
to oppose any attacks launched against women's rights and women's health."

It's bizarre how women's choice has turned to a place where we're debating contraception.

Story: WYFP??, Scott Wooledge, dKos

- end quote - - end quote - - end quote -

Not all that bizarre. It is just a continuation of the
War on icky Lady Parts by Wingnutia that believes
those icky lady parts need to be wrapped in a pair
of fresh white old lady undies at all times with the
exception of daily bodily functions and the weekly
Fri. night procreation time with hubby.

Their "Culture War" is mostly about that, and ending
the near 50 year '60s hippies' reign of Free s-e-x.

All part of their War on Hippies, War on Women and
War on Workers - all designed to dismantle FDR's
'New Deal' and LBJ's 'Great Society.'

Social Security??
Gone!

Medicare??
Gone!

Unions??
Gone!

Teachers teaching Librul horse$h!t??
Gone!

'60s S-E-X ??
Over!
History!
No condoms, no birth control pills and no "morning after" pills for you!
You F* a teenager by the Jebus, she gonna have that kid
come Hell or high water!

WIC, Food Stamps??
Ha!
Gone!

Get. A. F*ing. JOB!!

... evil

johnqpublic · « **Reply #44 on:** February 10, 2012, 12:43:15 AM »

This proves two things: There are too damned many laws already if lawmakers don't know they exist already, and any lawmaker who votes for a potential new law without reading it first and knowing what's in it should be run out of office immediately if not sooner.

...an HHS official told Mother Jones that it would "enforce this the same way we enforce everything else in the law."

Let the waivers begin.

...full throated support... on contraception....

A pretty much foolproof form that doesn't cost a cent.

EvilJam · « **Reply #45 on:** February 10, 2012, 02:09:05 AM »

Tweet of the Day...

@other98

RT @athompson: When JFK ran, they feared the POTUS would answer to the Pope.
Today they're livid that Obama doesn't answer to the Pope.

Exactly.

... evil

The Reaper · « **Reply #46 on:** February 10, 2012, 09:04:06 AM »

White House to Announce ‘Accommodation’ for Religious Organizations on Contraception Rule

Sounds like someone blinked.

bigbore45 · « **Reply #47 on:** February 10, 2012, 10:44:33 AM »

What races are increasing and what races are decreasing?

NNYBibliophile · « **Reply #48 on:** February 10, 2012, 11:08:39 AM »

Quote from: bigbore45 on February 10, 2012, 10:44:33 AM

What races are increasing...?

The human race. And that's why we need more contraception.

bigbore45 · « **Reply #49 on:** February 10, 2012, 11:25:59 AM »

Out of 225 countries, 2- china and india have 48 percent
of the human race. Send them the birth control if you really
think they would use it.

johnqpublic · « **Reply #50 on:** February 10, 2012, 11:30:24 AM »

And that's why we need more contraception.

A good case could be made that that kind of thinking could lead to forced contraception -- the Chinese one and done rule -- strictly enforced by a totalitarian, authoritarian state. I agree we need more contraception, but it should always be a personal choice and a personal responsibility. I believe we need more contraception because a great many people not suited to parenting become parents anyway and the circle is unbroken -- poverty, neglect, abuse, crime -- et cetera, ad infinitum, ad nauseam.

bigbore45 · « **Reply #51 on:** February 10, 2012, 11:34:33 AM »

http://bigthink.com/ideas/21343

Just a tid bit on how much land the Feds own and
they say birth control is the problem.

The Reaper · « **Reply #52 on:** February 10, 2012, 12:19:28 PM »

Quote from: NNYBibliophile on February 10, 2012, 11:08:39 AM

Quote from: bigbore45 on February 10, 2012, 10:44:33 AM
What races are increasing...?

The human race. And that's why we need more contraception.

Ah, but do we need contraception as opposed to Third World nations where the real population growth is. Western nations are suffering from essentially stagnant population growth - Europe is an excellent example of this. So should the US abort itself into zero growth while Africa grows at an exponential rate? This is the same problematic approach to "global warming" where by the greenies want to dump all the restrictions on the US while China and others continue to pollute at increasing rates.

NNYBibliophile · « **Reply #53 on:** February 10, 2012, 12:32:53 PM »

There needs to be more contraception everywhere, including this country. We still have way too many unwanted pregnancies in the United States, in large part because religious nutjobs are opposed to contraception. It's no surprise that the highest rates of teen pregnancy are in the Bible Belt.

The Reaper · « **Reply #54 on:** February 10, 2012, 12:54:59 PM »

Quote from: NNYBibliophile on February 10, 2012, 12:32:53 PM

It's no surprise that the highest rates of teen pregnancy are in the Bible Belt.

Anchor babies among the illegals.

tree68 · « **Reply #55 on:** February 10, 2012, 01:10:27 PM »

Quote from: NNYBibliophile on February 10, 2012, 12:32:53 PM

It's no surprise that the highest rates of teen pregnancy are in the Bible Belt.

Barefoot and pregnant.

It's no coincidence that most of the same folks who are against abortion are also against birth control.

Selma · « **Reply #56 on:** February 10, 2012, 01:54:59 PM »

Quote from: MAMAD on February 09, 2012, 07:47:29 PM

Dummer, why do you believe I am bitter? Because I don't believe that religion has any place in government or outside your home and place of worship? I believe people should follow the rules, which includes all people and religion should not be a way around the rules. Sooo sorry if you disagree. That is your right.

I am sick of illegal breeders and welfare whores living off my tax dollars. When going on welfare ,I would endorce mandatory birth control. I don't give a sh!t what the church says about it. It is the only way they will get any new members. Why should we pay for these people to have children they can't afford. We all suffer, especially the children. They don't have a chance. You sure don't see the catholic church supporting these children. Birth control and mandatory job training and a job. I don't mind helping people, I just don't want to support them. I believe in making people take responsability for their life and their family. If they won't, no help available.

Once again, it's the government interfering with the Catholic church, not the other way around. I beleive contraception should be covered by insurance, but in this case there should be an exemption.

As to your second paragraph, huh? We're talking about a relatively small number of people who work at Catholic institutions. That means they hold a job and pay taxes just like you, so I'm not sure where you think that "illegal breeders and welfare whores" come into it.

Also, once again, nobody is saying they can't use birth control. The Catholic church is just against being forced to pay for it when it violates their beliefs. Anyone who has a problem with it can choose not to work for the Catholic church.

bigbore45 · « **Reply #57 on:** February 10, 2012, 02:08:48 PM »

http://www.eurthisnthat.com/2011/04/10/whites-in-america-are-fast-becoming-a-minority-in-america/

Caucasians will be the minority.

NNYBibliophile · « **Reply #58 on:** February 10, 2012, 02:24:46 PM »

Quote from: bigbore45 on February 10, 2012, 02:08:48 PM

http://www.eurthisnthat.com/2011/04/10/whites-in-america-are-fast-becoming-a-minority-in-america/

Caucasians will be the minority.

So? Are you scared of brown people? Does that extra melanin in their skin cause a problem?

The Reaper · « **Reply #59 on:** February 10, 2012, 02:45:20 PM »

Quote from: NNYBibliophile on February 10, 2012, 02:24:46 PM

Quote from: bigbore45 on February 10, 2012, 02:08:48 PM

http://www.eurthisnthat.com/2011/04/10/whites-in-america-are-fast-becoming-a-minority-in-america/

Caucasians will be the minority.

So? Are you scared of brown people? Does that extra melanin in their skin cause a problem?

It only causes a problem when put to the statement that you made:

Quote from: NNYBibliophile on February 10, 2012, 12:32:53 PM

There needs to be more contraception everywhere, including this country. We still have way too many unwanted pregnancies in the United States

If whites are becoming a "minority", it stands to reason that people of color are responsible for said population growth and thus should be the ones using contraceptives. Except in politically correct America, to suggest that minorities need to use contraceptives and/or abortion to help with the population "explosion" is to be accused of "racism" and "genocide" of minority races.